This TP&WD article offers great scientific information about livewell oxygen injection systems and bass boat livewell water quality with power point pics of the homemade oxygen injection system they used. After reading the article I Googled ( livewell oxygen injection systems, bass tournaments ) and found much more detailed information and research about oxygen injection systems for bass boats: http://www.oxygedge-chum.com The article makes it clear to me that livewell aerators and water pumps are not the best livewell equipment to insure minimal safe oxygenation and there are definitely better ways to insure safe oxygenation in summer tournaments. Many bass tournaments now use 100% compressed oxygen in weigh-in tanks, “hospital tanks” and tournament release boats with excellent reduced mortality results. Now I understand why they use pure oxygen injection. Seems logical to me that using 100% oxygen injection in tournament boat livewells would provide the best bass care since the catch will be riding around in the boat livewells a long tome, 6-7 hours or more.Maybe tournament directors/contestants should rethink the “Functional Livewell Rule.” What does a “functional livewell really mean?” Does it mean the livewell water pump works when you flip the switch on? Does it mean the aerator air pump blows air bubbles through the air stone? After reading the article and website, its becomes obviously to me that the “Functional Livewell Rule” has nothing to do with maintaining minimal safe oxygen saturations when the livewell is full of fish. I always thought the point of this rule was to insure a safe livewell water quality for the catch, but I was completely misled now that I know more facts about what makes bass boat livewell really “functional.” Its the water quality that makes a tournament boats’ livewell functional or nonfunctional, not the shape of the livewell or the water pumps or the air pumps and air stones.Ive learned a lot of new stuff about this in the last few days and am glad to share that with you.
Great to discuss this with a bass boat trader and experienced summer tournament bass fisherman, thanks for participating and sharing your opinions about the “Tiger Tank Oxygen System.” Why in the world would the average tournament bass fishermen buy this oxygen system add on when the standard aerated boat livewell already comes with the boat- and that is free?The tournament bass fisherman always make a serious personal choice whether he will provide the best possible bass care all day transporting his tournament catch or provide less than the best possible bass care all day in summer tournaments.The pro’s – simple oxygen technologysimple to operateproven technology has been commercially available to sport fishermen over 2 decades since the early 1990’s, The con’s – more stuff taking up space in the boatadditional cost to keep fish alive in the summercan be a fire hazard if not used incorrectly and/or irresponsiblyUsing a livewell oxygen system is summer tournaments is really a no brainer for the savvy bass boat buyer that fishes summer tournament and has done his bass care homework before he shops for a bass boat. He must get all of his catch to the weighmaster after a hot rough all day transport – to win, all the catch must be weighed alive or at least with gill plate moving a little. Only 1 dead fish and you lose the tournament.For the less savvy tournament bass boat buyer, the con’s will totally outweigh the pro’s on all points. Aerators, water pumps, ice, livewell chemicals and hope… that’s all he will do for all his bass all day in July-August. He going to think about his catch and look in the livewell every few minutes to see what’s sick or dead in July.*What is it about the Bass Cat livewell O2 system that impressed you most compared to all the other types of O2 systems on the market sold OEM or after-market add-on’s to oxygenate bass boat livewells? The price, type of system, dependability or quality of the system?“Bass Cats system is top of the line…” If you don’t mind, what actually makes it “top of the line” in your opinion? I Googled “compare livewell oxygen systems” and found several types, several brands, systems made with real commercial O2 regulators and many made with medical O2 regulators. Did not find any Bass Cat brand “Tiger Tank O2 system” in comparison.“… pure oxygen can be a fire hazard if not handled correctly.” I believe that’s a fact!In your opinion, how do you handle 100% pure oxygen gas and high pressure oxygen equipment safely and correctly on any bass boat? Is there a lot to know about handling pure 100% oxygen correctly and safely or no? Where does a fisherman go to learn pure oxygen safety on boats? Where and what does a fisherman look to learn how to handle pure 100% oxygen correctly and safely on any fishing boat or anywhere else? An oxygen fire is very different than an air fire, A pure oxygen enriched fire on any boat is a real big problem. What all would you do to prevent a pure oxygen fire on a boat? Better yet, how will you extinguish a pure oxygen enriched fire on your boat if it happened?Oxygen safety is relative for the product manufacturer and the salesman, example: The livewell Oxygenator oxygen generator produces and delivers pure 100% pure oxygen too. Little to no mention is available about oxygen fire hazards, fire safety or how to safely handle pure oxygen or oxygen enriched livewells or bait tanks on a boat. Clearly pure oxygen gas safety is not worth mentioning in the sales literature and infomercials. To me, pure 100% O2 gas is pure 100% O2 gas whether it comes out of a pressurized oxygen tank, from the electrolysis of livewell water, a LOX system. Careless and ignorant use of pure 100% oxygen can definitely be a fire hazard on a boat, a hospital or the space shuttle, right? Saw no oxygen safety warning on the Bass Cat website addressing fire hazards when using 100% pure oxygen on their boats or issues about running pure oxygen continuously all day hour after hour inside their boat livewells? I can surely see that fire safety using pure oxygen should be extremely important to buyers and users. Seems to me that O2 gas safety should be high priority for discussion by all BC boat salesmen and also of vital importance to any/all savvy fishermen considering the 2017 “Tiger Tank O2 system.”I have not seen the Tiger Tank O2 System, different high pressure O2 tanks sizes to select from and spare tanks, air stone or the high pressure O2 regulator, instructions how to use it; I found it odd there’s no info. Since you are a boat trader and in the know, do you have any pics of this O2 rig and technical info about it… how to use it, how to set the regulator, where the O2 tank should be placed on the BC boat? Spent time looking, didn’t find any information on the Bass Cat website addressing safe handling of pure 100% oxygen gas and livewell O2 injection equipment on a BC boat; no oxygen fire safety, no high pressure O2 tank safety, no high pressure oxygen regulator safety, no safety info about oxygen enriched gas spaces in livewells, no safety info about using pure 100% oxygen gas… do you have any of this safety information or how I get this oxygen safety info from Bass Cat Boats?Of course all this high-tech safety hub-bub about pure 100% oxygen gas, oxygen enriched livewells and high pressure oxygen equipment safety is totally meaningless with the standard boat livewells using mechanical aeration, water pumps and plain old air for aeration… the old fashioned, low-tech, standard livewell stuff bass fishermen have used for many decades.
BCB guy, do you personally have direct experience with the TT O2 system this summer (June 2017) transporting a livewell full of bass 6-8 hours?My fishing buddy is also our family doctor. We were talking about livewell oxygenation and bass tournaments so I ask him a week or so back, “just how important do you believe having a continuous minimal safe oxygen supply available for all the catch in the livewell all day really is? Bass are only fish and a fish is kinda like a snake and it hard to suffocate a snake? He laughed and says having enough O2 is the most important, it vital. Put a plastic bag over your head (like a bass in a bass bag or take a bass out of the water, cut off or severely limit the O2 supply), wait 2 minutes and feel what happens to you, breathing fast, increased excitement, maybe shear panic. After all, your are being suffocated and thats a real big deal! Wait 5 minutes and begin CPR and hope the brain damage is not too bad.I laughed and said, “OK, OK, I got the message Doc.” Is the dose of oxygen adjustable? The Doc told me that more fish (greater livewell biomass) require more oxygen.
You have a point there. Doctors, dentist, lawyers, politicians and us hourly paid welders that work for a living in the sun, rain and snow for $75.00/hr. Hes fresh out of med school and makes a smooth $200 K a year and he fishes all the time!… some of us really do make better choices than others, what a life. He will not, does not, want treat any sickleys that have Obama Care health insurance. says Obama Care does not pay any bills. Do you have experience with that TT O2 system this summer?
Bass Cat Boats wrote:They have not run a DO meter on the system with fish in it. That is one of the goals and they have simply not done that. The regulator and stone companies have done that research and while the amount of oxygen seems minimal, it is the amount that infuses the water which matters. If it is blowing hard through the column in the well, then there is little benefit as it dissipates. The system was initially tested, though not in hard conditions and sales have been very minimal. BCBWhere can I see the DO Test results your talking about? Even the DO test results with no fish in the livewell consuming O2… any test results will do for now. Show me if you will. Thanks for providing this data.
Hard data would be great! Hopefully your livewell DO testing will be realistic, summer tournament conditions with 15-20 lbs. of bass in the livewell when the test is done… thats realistic. DO testing with no fish in the livewell is not realistic, fodder. A thought or 2…Maybe (2) controlled DO saturation test: 1st test with aeration system only – standard BCB aerators or water pumps running and humming with no fish in the livewell and 2nd DO test with 15-20 lbs. of bass in the livewell.2nd test with TT O2 system only with no fish in the livewell and the 2nd test with 15-20 lbs. of bass in the oxygen enriched livewell.The comparative DO Saturation test results is the real proof your puddin. The DO test are simple and easy to do… are you sure you really want to know the test results, if that BCB aerated livewell is really functional and if the TTO2 system is really functional tested in realistic summertime summer conditions with a heavy limit of bass in that BCB livewell? You could be really surprised at what you might discover with that DO Meter?
Dont feel bad, most fishermen, fishing article writers and the general public have no clue what bass boat livewell DO testing is all about, what DO is safe for live fish transport and whats not safe at all or what the test results actually mean. A few have heard that 5 PPM DO is good but, thats an EPA standard indicating good environmental water (lakes, rivers, pond) standards in the steady state. Live fish transport DO water standards were developed by Federal and State fish hatcheries to insure minimal safe oxygenation during transport. Traumatic capture, confinement and all day transport is highly stressful, causes tremendous excitement and adrenaline production. All that increases physiological oxygen demand and increase in oxygen uptake dramatically. Live transports DO requirements are definitely nothing even close to steady state lake DO standards and requirements. If the DO is high enough in a livewell containing fish and the fish do not suffocate in transport, IF, the livewell or haul tank is not overstocked. If fish belly up, die or die a few days post release the cause is probably acute or chronic suffocation during transport especially in the summer.Testing the DO reveals if there is enough DO for all the fish in transport or there is not enough DO. If the DO test reveals there is not enough oxygen for all the fish in the livewell, the fish will suffocate, and if the fish suffocate, that is proof-positive that the livewell is “not function” and acute and post transport mortality and disease might be predicted and anticipated.Theres much more… minimal safe DO in transport livewells and haul tanks is vitally important. I do hope the TT produces satisfactory DO test results with fish in the livewell water, well see what happens. If the TT DO test results and test conditions are published and advertised, the DO test results are probably good. If there are no test results available, the TT may have failed the test and will just fade away.A good DO test result is the proof that may sell the TT O2 system.
I ran across an interesting article here – B.A.S.S./ESPN, about livewell Oxygen Injection systems. BCB has clearly taken a bit of the apple introducing the TT O2 injection system. Check this piece out: Keeping Bass Alivehttp://www.espn.com/outdoors/bassmaster … e_livewell Oxygen injectionOxygen uptake in livewell water can be improved by flowing pure oxygen from a pressurized cylinder into the livewell through an air stone or bubble hose. A regulator or pressure valve controls the flow. The tiny bubbles contain 100 percent oxygen and provide a huge surface area for the oxygen to diffuse into the water. These systems will maintain adequate oxygen levels in the livewell under the most extreme conditions. For some anglers this may be a more attractive option than managing oxygen levels by aeration and temperature control (adding ice). Oxygenation systems can be purchased commercially for $300 to $450. A supplier is listed on page 39. Follow the manufacturers directions very carefully, as there are serious safety requirements when dealing with oxygen. Homemade systems can be assembled from equipment purchased from welding shops, medical apparatus vendors, or aquaculture equipment suppliers. But, DO NOT install a homemade oxygenation system on your boat without the guidance of an expert. If installation guidelines are not strictly adhered to, serious injury could result. If these safety requirements are too restrictive, retrofit the plumbing of your livewell aeration system (see diagram, page 15) to ensure that proper oxygen concentrations can be achieved, even with a heavy load of fish. Before investing in an oxygenation system, anglers must be totally familiar with the safety considerations regarding its use. U.S. Coast Guard regulations require pressurized gas cylinders to be securely mounted to prevent damage to valves and regulators. The cylinder must be mounted in a well-ventilated location and smoking should be avoided during use. [FIRE SAFETY] Never use grease or petroleum-based lubricants on oxygen equipment fittings or connectors. This can cause an explosive fire.
Bass Cat Boats wrote:We install the systems and we have used the oxygen systems. The cost is significant and it is a dealer price item. We have not offered an add on kit as of this time. BCBWhat do you charge for the complete system with a full tank of gas – the instillation fee… drive out price?Where are you located?
How much does the TT O2 system option cost?
SteveD wrote:Wow, either the innovation, quality, or craftsmanship is not there or when its provided and the price is too high. Cutting edge innovation costs money, development costs, labor costs and material costs all add to it. Quality and craftsmanship cost money, better work force in a competitive area filled with boat builders. You want the best product it starts with the best of all of those, and that aint free. I spend a great deal of time working boat shows this time of year. There is a common theme among bass boat manufacturers that i see at these boat shows across the mid south. The industry has stopped trying to build “the better mouse trap”. Innovation is no longer a common goal with the exception of one bass boat product line, Basscat. The vinyl used in seats, the gauges in the consoles, the plastic trim used to finish the look and cover seams all have dropped in the quality of the material used and the thickness of that material, the carpet gauge as well as the overall finish and product quality diminishes year after year. Boats are no longer built to last a life time, but to look good at the new at the show. This will be proven in the coming years.I know it has always been “Politically Incorrect” to name competitor names but to prove my point in this instance Im gonna jump in. I was a 18+ year Ranger guy. I ran the product because of my perception of quality of not only the product but the people behind it. That stopped when the love for the quality, innovation and customer service appeared to stop. I shopped boats and made a change Basscat in 2012 for the better and havent regretted it since. This weekend at the Springfield Mo boat show I walked over and looked at a 2018 Z520L. Rangers SRS seat was at one time the finest in the business, today their seat has only one obvious goal, meet a price point. It was flat with very little bolstering and support. The seat gave the appearance of a Tempress folding fishing seat with a nice cover. The boat was riddled with very thin vacuum formed ABS plastic parts screwed in place with a black self tapping screw. The “new” dashes for 2018 have significantly less fiberglass and 40% of the construction was also vacuum formed ABS. Although there are great applications for ABS, outdoors in a harsh environment attached to a material that flexes and moves is not the ideal one. UV inhibitors help with the mortality of this material but over time they will break down in ultraviolet light and will get a gray haze appearance and crack (everyone has seen it before on boats built in the 80s). I understand that ABS is commonly used in many outdoor applications such as the automobile industry but is coated, or painted to avoid UV attack. Many other decor parts have been changed to take dollars out i wont list them all. Sure, we will know that since Rangers acquisition quality and cost have been taken out of those brands acquired, but it was happening long before. Look at the others they are doing too.I singled out one competitor product line i know, but it is happening in most of them. Pay close attention when you walk through the boats shows this year, youll see it.We are all lucky enough to be affiliated with THE superior product in this market. Proven quality, innovation, and without question the best people. The capital investments being made to bring new products such as the Lynx to the Premium line and the Pantera Classic to the budget conscious. The new Wave Crusher seat design, new dash for the larger and multiple graphs, Honda,& Suzuki added to the engine options, new control panel, and a wake and puddle lights. This should speak volumes for BCBs commitment to the innovation of the industry. This does not mention the things you cannot easily see, vinyl ester resin adds greatly to the material cost of the premium boats, the seats constructed of cool hyde vinyl, 24 gauge carpet (every other builder uses 14-18 gauge carpet), tinned wire throughout the boat. Each one of these add cost. I could go on & on, but ill stop. The Tiger Tank is a great idea to improve a livewell that was already great. I dont own one. Ive lost one fish due to livewell mortality in a BCB livewell in 6 years, and it was most likely my fault she was dead. Not buying the tiger tank was a gamble I was willing to take, still taking it. That doesnt make it a “Dumb Idea”, a “Waste of Money” or “Too Expensive”. A little studying says, the price is fair. I do see it as out of the box thinking, dreaming of “The Better Mousetrap” and doing something about it. Exactly what a strong brand does to get stronger and i commend BCB for that.agg271, owning a quality high performance boat like a Basscat costs money, your either willing to pay it or compromise on one or all of what I and other Basscat owners perceive as “Quality”. Actually I do find this subject and the various livewell O2 technologies that have evolved in the last decade interesting from a summer tournament bass conservation angle. Some tournament officials tout that summer tournament bass tournament conservation is a big deal. Ray Scott even claimed the same thing. There has been considerable fluff in the news about summer bass tournament fish kills every summer. The Bassmaster Classic tournament was changed from the 1st part of August to February/March (the dead coldest time of winter) for some reason after the Classic tournament bass kill in New Orleans a few years ago for some odd reason. Now the contestants need had warmers and long under ware and fight the cold several days. Great points Steve. The boat industry has change considerably over the years and you are right-on target; it is most important that new boats must *look good and *run fast. The cockpit must look like a fighter jet cock pit with many bells, buzzers, alarms, gages and switches. Most of this cockpit fluff has to do with livewell operations. So Steve, in your opinion, what do you think BCB and/or TPWD could do to change/avoid repeating the same marketing mistakes of 2017 in order make sales viable this year for the TT O2 rigs? TPWD also has also failed miserably to promote and market same livewell O2 equipment for bass boat applications and they use O2 technology extensively in all hatchery and live fish transports across Texas all the time and they are real fish care experts. And as you can see just this little ole thread, many tournament bass fishermen scoff at and mock the livewell O2 life saving technology that has been scientifically proven to reduce summer bass tournament mortality. Just aint interested and will have none of it, get loud and hostile when O2 rigs are mentioned. The TT O2 technology simply cost too much and *** is not necessary like a livewell aerator and water pump so says bass tournament rules. Yet many tournament officials use compressed O2 rigs in live release boats and holding tanks every summer. They would not have a summer tournament or any live release boat without compressed O2 on board even though livewell O2 technology was totally unheard a few years ago when that was scorned and scoffed at by tournament officials. Actually, the BCB sales material I have seen and BCB salesmens presentations I have heard present no compelling reason to spend a few hundred bucks on a TT O2 rig when the BCB livewells come with aerators and water pumps at no additional charge. No additional charge for something sounds like FREE to me and like every other bass fisherman in America we like FREE stuff. An O2 rig costing a few hundred bucks cannot. will never compete with FREE livewell aerators/water pumps that come with the boat livewells. You are right Steve – Speaking of the “best tournament bass care possible” that any tournament fisherman can provide, bass boat buyer are either willing to pay for the livewell O2 technology or you reject it. The state of the art livewell technology was clearly rejected at that price in 2017. Is it possible for BCB to revise their marketing strategy for their TT O2 rig and create a viable market for this add on equipment? Because, 2017 sales is a mess.
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